I was testing you...

Moderators: cataclysm80, Apocalypse2K, berkumps, dragsamou, mystical_tutor, pp, hammr7, l0qii

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ende73
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Post by ende73 » Tue Feb 07, 2006 1:21 pm

dragsamou wrote: Ralph,Please find another Moderator.Thanks.
That's the only part I personally agree with.

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dragsamou
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Post by dragsamou » Tue Feb 07, 2006 1:30 pm

ende73 wrote:
dragsamou wrote: Ralph,Please find another Moderator.Thanks.
That's the only part I personally agree with.
Hi Enrico.
Explain why,at least ;-)
Do you worry about those or others in your Collection?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 8747524999
Not so sure anymore about this one:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 8749895950
Etc....
I'm also very interested to know the opinion of the Members that were
Really Involved as they are the ones who offer the money to Raphy.
What's theirs conclusions about that experiment?
Last edited by dragsamou on Tue Feb 07, 2006 4:03 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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jamesbond
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Post by jamesbond » Tue Feb 07, 2006 1:46 pm

i think the best conclusion sould be:

i will be very carefull from now on ........to buy/trade cards with anyone >:-(

gerrikabeitia
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Post by gerrikabeitia » Tue Feb 07, 2006 2:06 pm

Well people,
It seems to me people are making a too big of a deal with this question!
First of all, the sale didn't take place, did it?
Secondly, collecting items is a risky business, it doesn't matter if it's a painting, a stamp or a MTG card. If you want to be sure on what you're buying you'll have to pay for some specialist to inspect the item or buy it directly from a some store or auctioner who has the knowledge to certify you're buying the real thing. I don't think that MTG cards have reached that point but I'm sure they will in the future.
Thirdly, this type of cards are not like Summer Magic cards or Alternate 4th Edition, where you are sure that, that cards really were printed. There's a small possibility that there were some albino cards in Beta (probably near to 0.000000%), but even though people seem to be willing to put a lot of money at stake for that possibility.
Forthly, making that albino card took a lot of time and dedication. So why shouldn't you pay good money for that exclusive item and pay a lot for some fortuitous crimped card?

The last and not the least, I think Dragsamou is making a good job cleaning up the forum and being always aware for what anyone could need, so he should stay as a moderator!!!

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pickle.69
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Post by pickle.69 » Tue Feb 07, 2006 2:46 pm

I would like Alexis to stay as a moderator in the first place!
He is doing a lot of work for the library itself and especialy I think as he is mainly cleaning the forum this has nothing to do with it at all in the first place.

Ok I understand that some of you feel very upset.
You don`t want to trade with him or Raphael in the future, just do it.

My first reaction to Rapheals post where these:
What a great card, I want a bigger scan.
I did not get it, still I offered 500 for the card, knowing who he is in the forum, and knew that it would not be enough.
I honestly wonderd why there was still some color in the card, I never asked it.
He could have sold me this card for the price and I might never have found out what realy happend.
Actually if he had made 6 he could have sold them all, run away with a couple of thousands and get flamed, done evrything correct we might not even have been able to get a cent of our lost money back, IF we ever found out.


What realy lets me think about two things I wanted to do for years now but never took the time:
1) What happens to card exposed to bright light or a variant of chemicals for a long time.
2) Most important of all:
How exactly are cards made.What can happen as a mistake. What is not even theoreticly possible.

I am at the moment developing Miscutting theorys and trying all possibilitys of getting miscutted cards. If you think about it and have a little knowledge about the printing process this gets you into a hughe mess. You should try it, there are 100ds of possebilitys, and variantes.

This brings me to my new project which I wanted to do for a long time and which , due to raphaels "Member test" will be done by me very soon.

How does the printing process work, where can errors happen, which consequences does it have on the card. What external effects can produce what.

I think we as a forum should take this "luckely only a test"- situation and make us some real headache about this.

We have quite some knowlege in mispint experts in the forum and and some realy good professionals. We need to bring it in some sort of usefull form.

No harm was done!
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Post by mahdishain » Tue Feb 07, 2006 3:28 pm

pickle.69 wrote: No harm was done!
and more importantly, no harm was intended. this test was designed to help members. even if you think the test was misguided, please realize raphael had the benefit of members in mind.

i think alexis has done an excellent job cleaning up the site. kudos!

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dragsamou
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Post by dragsamou » Tue Feb 07, 2006 3:52 pm

Hi Members.
I just would like to share,how everything's starts.
Jamesbond,which he's one of the Oldest Member on Magic Rarities,have always been very helpful to me for the understanding of the Integrity of MTG cards,it's because of him,that I could get back the money,from the
Fake Foil Filler that I bought from a Seller.That leads to the multiple posts about Fake Foils,and to the benefit of the community,knowing Now how to distinguish a Real One from a Fake one.Thanks Raphy ;-)
Regarding the Fork,everything start from here in 2004.
http://www.magiclibrary.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=327
Over the years,I have seen the Amazing result that the light does on this Card,and I said to Raphy,you should put it on Ebay,to see How much you could get on that Special Fork.Never it was intended to sell the Card,but
to check What a Supposed Albino could reach ;-)
Well,Raphy decided to put it on the Forum and this was not planned.
http://www.magiclibrary.net/phpBB2/view ... 84&start=0
I give him a phone call straight,mentioning that a Bunch of Members that are also my friends,will certainly ask me about it,anyway,I did my part of the experiment,I remain silent or very vague and didn't interfere at all with the negociations.Well,a Week after the offer of Raphy, a Faded card could have been sold 1500$ on this Forum,I don't imagine how much,he could have got on Ebay,probably much more.It was time to tell the truth
Albinos/Miscolored can be more than tricky,and I'm sure that some Members will look twice now at what they own,or buy on Ebay even from Reputable Sellers regarding this particular type of Misprints.Starting by me,I can take a Beautiful Albino type card that was in my Misprint Binder that I did get from a very reputable Seller and that I bought as Granted.
Thanks Again Raphy,even if this time,I won't get back my money ;-)
This Experience was aimed to Help the Community not to take Money by any means,and Raphy could have made a lot of $$$$$$$$$$$ without anyone knowing the truth.One more time,I take Full responsability,for having beeing part of that One more Great Experience on this Forum.
That was Good =D>
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pp
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Post by pp » Tue Feb 07, 2006 4:32 pm

Hi,
I also do not understand the reactions of some people here. Image

jamesbond is trying to warn you and you are getting angry?! he??

@AXIOS: wow nice comment - better keep this for you next time Image

@dragsamou: don't rush, there are people here which appreciante your work

Patrick

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dry cereal
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Post by dry cereal » Tue Feb 07, 2006 6:05 pm

I think this was a great service, but the next step is to tell us how to tell the difference.

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psrex
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Post by psrex » Tue Feb 07, 2006 6:21 pm

I think that Hank has already told us one of the clues to look for -- see if there is still blue left on the card. It would be interesting to get a high-res scan of the card to determine if there are any faint traces of pink remaining or if the color has faded completely.

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dragsamou
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Post by dragsamou » Tue Feb 07, 2006 7:04 pm

psrex wrote:I think that Hank has already told us one of the clues to look for -- see if there is still blue left on the card. It would be interesting to get a high-res scan of the card to determine if there are any faint traces of pink remaining or if the color has faded completely.
Hi.
Factor of Time Exposure,is a Big thing,as over weeks,monthes and the years,the result is not the same at all.The Type of Sunlight used to faded the card is also another factor,etc....But the Expert is Raphy.
To my eyes,The Fork over 2 years have reached an Almost Metalic Brownish color.
As,I will see my Partner in Crime(Raphy) tomorrow ;-) ,I will get the Fork from him,and scanned it under 600DPI or More,I will gladly provide the scan to Members that need it for examination.Just PM me.
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Mr.C
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Post by Mr.C » Tue Feb 07, 2006 9:11 pm

dragsamou wrote:
psrex wrote:I think that Hank has already told us one of the clues to look for -- see if there is still blue left on the card. It would be interesting to get a high-res scan of the card to determine if there are any faint traces of pink remaining or if the color has faded completely.
Hi.
Factor of Time Exposure,is a Big thing,as over weeks,monthes and the years,the result is not the same at all.The Type of Sunlight used to faded the card is also another factor,etc....But the Expert is Raphy.
To my eyes,The Fork over 2 years have reached an Almost Metalic Brownish color.
As,I will see my Partner in Crime(Raphy) tomorrow ;-) ,I will get the Fork from him,and scanned it under 600DPI or More,I will gladly provide the scan to Members that need it for examination.Just PM me.
This made me curious about my IA lands. I think i'll hi-res them, although, i did get them from somone who's had them forever...

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flatmatt
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Post by flatmatt » Tue Feb 07, 2006 9:52 pm

Man, I miss out on the forum for a couple days and all hell breaks loose... Darn broken computers.

From a quick readthrough of the topic, looks like jamesbond was just trying to help. I don't think people need to go jumping down his throat for it.

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Post by Plastered_Dragon » Tue Feb 07, 2006 10:21 pm

People don't like to be fooled. Even if it is for their own good. I understand the hostility this "test" has evoked. What Raphael/Dragsamou need to keep in mind is that they DO have excellent reputations and therefore people trust them.

So the test, per se, is not really all that accurate. Yes if someone you have grown to trust decides to fool you, they're probably going to pull it off.

A better test would have been to set up an alternate account under a new username to offer the card. This would have reflected a more accurate representation of the gullibility of myself and others. I assumed the cards were legit because of who was posting about them. Not because I have some great knowledge of misprints.
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Post by hammr7 » Wed Feb 08, 2006 1:28 am

If people are going to check current albino or missing color cards, the best test might be a magnifying glass or microscope.

Given the kind of dot pattern printing that Wizards uses, you want to see if their is a faint residue of the missing color's spots. Residues of reds should be easier to pick up than those of yellow. If a card is truly missing one or more layers, then the card should be clean where those color dots should go. If the card is simply faded, then there should be some residue of the color.

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